If You Want What We Have.

» Jo Murphy - Hey Isshy

In response to message posted by ishmaelomega:

I am away during the days now.
Work has started back again!
I got your messages!
Let's try to hook up for a meeting soon,
Jo

-- posted by Jo Murphy

Permalink Print Discussion

» Jo Murphy - Online meeting?

In response to message posted by brisbaneartist:

OK
We can arrange a meeting for the weekend if you like.
You will have to post here though Isshy as
My computer will be off today,

Jo

-- posted by Jo Murphy

Permalink Print Discussion

» muncrief - Re: Online meeting?

In response to message posted by brisbaneartist:

Hey Jo and Isshy. This weekend will be tough for me. However, if we did it on Friday afternoon or evening for me, that would make it Saturday morning/early afternoon for you guys. Saturday for me is out. If we wait until Sunday for me, that makes it Monday for you and thus not possible what with work and all. I vote for Friday evening here which would be Saturday there. Just tell me what time between 9:00 a.m. Saturday (your time) and 2:00 p.m. (your time) would work best. I will try to make sure I have that time free.

I will also be offline most of today trying to finish my book for the discussion tonight. Darned router has had me jumping through hoops all day!

Bren

-- posted by muncrief

Permalink Print Discussion

» ishmaelomega - Re: Re: Online meeting?

Friday evening Bren time should be fine for me. There is a little uncertainty but this should be resolved within the next 12 hours . Shall try to confirm here or on the messenger. Ishmael

-- posted by ishmaelomega

Permalink Print Discussion

» ishmaelomega - Re: recovery

Hello Jo and Bren. I am looking forward to your asking me how I am, so I can tell you.
"Something" has resolved important areas of my thinking.
1) In reading through the book, in speaking with you both, in agonising my way through all the issues I have found it difficult to resolve a number of beliefs / feelings / philosophies.
I have had such a burst of clarity.
First : Of course alcoholism is a disease. I am ashamed that I previously applied a great deal of effort to the academic analysis of alcoholism as "described" as a disease and the merits or otherwise of viewing it thus. You must have been so frustrated with me.
Of course it is a disease. In my case it is a shared disease. As you know I don't drink and am not an alcoholic (so far as I know) but I am a co-alcoholic so I share the disease.
I need to do whatever it takes , provided my acts are born of selflessness and love to cure and help cure this disease. There is no price which is too high under these circumstances.
2) An alcoholic can measure the success of his day, to an extent by virtue of his or her sobriety ( one day at a time ). I intend to measure my daily success by virtue of staying on plan to cure this disease. Perhaps I will need to cut off cash supplies, perhaps I'll need to tell people what the issue is, perhaps I'll need to do things which incur wrath or get me divorced. It's all a lot better than watching this disease kill. Yes, I meant to put the full stop after the "kill".
3) My committment is to unload all my unnecessary baggage about god and religion.
I have no doubt there is something. I can say that with conviction. Not only " Who am I to say there is no God" but Who am I not to call this thing / him/her ' God '. The word communicates the idea rather well doesn't it , he says ironically! just because I have a problem with what I heard and saw of People claiming to have some franchise on God doen't mean that I have to embrace those people or their concepts or images to use the word.
I expect that this will all be difficult at times and I expect that I will struggle . My insecurities eat me alive now. At least I'm used to that. I will seek help when I am weak. I hope I haven't worn out my welcome with you both. I know that I'm at the beginning not the end but perhaps , to quote Churchill, it's the end of the beginning.
I dare you to ask me how I am?
And Jo -- Thanks
And Bren -- Thanks
Isshy

-- posted by ishmaelomega

Permalink Print Discussion

» Jo Murphy - More Balanced Reply

In response to message posted by ishmaelomega:

Hi Isshy, (and Bren)
I am feeling better today. When I spoke to you both yesterday I was waiting to have some treatment on my back and was feeling very tired.

I was a bit over whelmed with the over load of information when I clocked in!
That's why I asked for a rain check before answering.
Sometimes it pays to take stock and to really read the words before giving a glib anser.

I am amazed at how the higher power brings topics and questions to the suface at just the right time. When you see this months topic you will realize that to some extend I had written the answer to your questions before you asked them.

Even though I had planned to start writing about step one this month. I had realised that there was a confused jumble beginning.
There are spaces for sharing, writing and exploring issues and it could be a really good time to explore what they are.
This is a great exercise<img src="http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg..."> so that no one feels abandoned or overwhelmed by the vast ammount of information that will filter through our minds as we approach gaining an understanding of the recovery process.
You will see when the article is released on the first of the month. (They are all timed to be released then.) That the article is about journaling.
In the article I ask that you don't treat your journal as somewhere precious but rather a messy place where you can rapidly write down your ideas and work out solutions to them. It also helps to keep a record of problems and solutions and how they have come about. This will help you in the future.

---

I am ashamed that I previously applied a great deal of effort to the academic analysis of alcoholism as "described" as a disease and the merits or otherwise of viewing it thus. You must have been so frustrated with me.

Isshy I am going to ask you to do something for me?
This is like an exercise in self-nurture and self-love.
I am going to ask you to keep a journal.
A messy journal. And in it I want you to rapidly write down your thoughts like you have done here and on the instant messenger.
You would realise that I am trained as a counsellor and that there are techniques we use to help people come to terms with life and the situation they find themselves in.
I feel that you would benefit from the kind of "staying with" that so many of us need when we first come into recovery.
Staying with can often be a kind of mirroring where one person (in this case myself or Bren) reflects a particular habit to another until they come to a space where they can make choices about it.
However I want to see you start making choices before it even gets to the stage where we are saying....

"Isshy you are shaming yourself again."

Can you look at the statement above and rewrite it without shaming yourself?
Can you do that here. You never know someone could be reading and benefit greatly from realising that self love is something we cultivate.
It is not a magic gift from God it is something we develeop ourselves.
If you read the promises it distinctly says

If we work for it!

I am reading the rest of what you have written here as well as on the instant messenger and will come back with replies. It seems a valuable thing to do so that if other readers are reading it they can work through the issues too.

So thank you for allowing us insight into your world! I am sure you are helping others in that way.
I will come back and give a little insight into mine and we will get going.
I will come back with a post too about how you can get ready for the journaling exercise.
Talk soon.
Stay happy and gentle,
Jo

-- posted by Jo Murphy

Permalink Print Discussion

» ishmaelomega - Re: This disease called alcoholism

Hi ya Jo. Hey Bren. I now believe that alcoholism is a disease. It took me a little while to realise this. The realisation , after having applied a good deal of internal argument, came to me in a gentle , matter of fact, fashion. In the order of : " well, of course it's a disease".
This belief makes sense on so many levels that it provides a certain order or harmony for me.
It is compatible with other elements of the early days of my recovery and this bolsters my hope.
It seems there is wholism being generated and that purpose, confidence and peace are crystallising from what was sadness and confusion.
I am grateful to you, Jo , and to Bren for being patient with me whilst I was working it out.
Ishmael

-- posted by ishmaelomega

Permalink Print Discussion

» Jo Murphy - Re: Re: This disease called alcoholism

In response to message posted by ishmaelomega:

ahhh!
That seems balanced to me!
Jo

-- posted by Jo Murphy

Permalink Print Discussion

» ishmaelomega - A Test

Hello Jo and Bren. Thanks for your time today. Indeed thanks for all your time. When I returned from our electronic meeting today, I met a wife who had used the time to empty a bottle. Funny, what a bottle can do.
I had known that there would be challenges along the way. The emptying of the bottle joined a few other elements . I don't intend to go a lot further other than to mention it here because I think it shows an honest record particularly after my recent exuberance.
Ish

-- posted by ishmaelomega

Permalink Print Discussion

» Jo Murphy - Yes!

In response to message posted by ishmaelomega:

yes and thankyou for giving others a yardstick of the way it really is.
Yes I knew that it would be difficult.
Isshy did you buy a journal on the way home?
Stay focused and gentle,
Jo

-- posted by Jo Murphy

Permalink Print Discussion