Once You're Saved You're Always Saved
- BaptistBetty
- themos100
- Bill_Samuel
- Phili28
- URfriend
- southeastga
- southeastga
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» BaptistBetty - Salvation-Must it Be Renewed
Hi! I am a Baptist but I am very interested in Quakerism. My boyfriend is a Quaker and we have very deep discussions about our differences in Beliefs. Especially about Salvation. I belive that once you are saved you are always saved and you can't loose you're salvation no matter what. I have many verses to back up that belief. Example: Phil. 1:6 "Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ." I am very interested in finding the truth on this matter. Why do you believe you can loose your salvation?-- posted by BaptistBetty
» themos100 - Re: Salvation-Must it Be Renewed
In response to message posted by BaptistBetty:Its probably important not to get too concerned about this question. Let's look to human relationships - my son could do whatever he wants in life but at any time he can come back to me and be welcomed, and he remains my son at all times. If me, a mere man, can have such a sense of loyalty, would God be any less loyal?
Having said that, as a British Quaker, probably my view of salvation is rather different than it was ten years ago when I was in fact a pastor of a free Baptist-like church. I now feel that we don't really need to ask the question "Am I saved". Questions about the afterlife are probably far beyone our limited understanding and we can just have child-like trust that everything will work out alright in the end. As the poet T S Elliot said (quoting the mediaeval Mother Julian of Norwich), "All shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well".
I hope the Editor of this topic, Bill Samuel doesn't mind me jumping in here but this is a topic I feel strongly about.
-- posted by themos100
» Bill_Samuel - Re: Salvation-Must it Be Renewed
1. Please note that the discussions are a forum for all, not simply for dialogue between the Contributing Editor and questioners. Therefore, all are welcome to express themselves in regard to anything posted here.2. Proposition 9 of Barclay's Apology, the most systematic theological work of early Friends (Quakers), states:
Although this gift, and inward grace of God, be sufficient to work out salvation, yet in those in whom it is resisted it both may and doth become their condemnation. Moreover, in whom it hath wrought in part, to purify and sanctify them, in order to their further perfection, by disobedience such may fall from it, and turn it to wantonness, making shipwreck of faith; and after "having tasted of the heavenly gift, and been made partakers of the Holy Ghost, again fall away." Yet such an increase and stability in the truth may in this life be attained, from which there cannot be a total apostasy.
3. Personally, I believe that we as humans can not be fully sure exactly what is required by God to be saved. I think the scriptural warning that we not judge refers to the ultimate judgment that is God's.
4. We are called to transformation of our whole lives through allowing God's work within us. A view that regards something that happens in a moment as securing us, and regards the way we live our lives thereafter as unimportant, does not seem consistent with scripture.
-- posted by Bill_Samuel
» Phili28 - Re: Salvation-Must it Be Renewed
In response to message posted by BaptistBetty:Hi, My name is Steven and I am 14, I belive that once saved always saved is true. My dad doesnt, and I was wondering if I give you some verses that I know of you could help me out and give me some verses that backs up once saved always saved.
I agree with your writting 100%, Thaks Steven.
Eph 2:8-9
1 John 1:9
1 John 2:12,25
1 John 5:13
-- posted by Phili28
» URfriend - Re: Re: Salvation-Must it Be Renewed
In response to Re: Salvation-Must it Be Renewed posted by Phili28:Dear Friend,
This is the way I currently understand the eternal security issue.
SALVATION:
Salvation is by grace through faith. It has been provided through Jesus Christ for all. There is no other name given whereby mankind must be saved. However, He is the Saviour of all men, especially those who believe.
PREDESTINATION
Predestination refers to God's placement of all into Christ.
God created all things in, and by Christ.
All things now consist and exist in, and by Christ.
And there is also a restoration of all things in Christ.
God has freely given this salvation to all, in Christ.
Election is the selection of individuals for eternal life, with Christ, to fellowship with God.
This salvation is by grace, accomplished through the faith of Christ, resident in him. It is not of ourselves. There is nothing in an individual that persuades God to grant salvation to us.
Alienated from the life of God in the mind, because of the blindness of the heart, we did not respond until assisted to do so. When we respond to the offer of salvation depends on the prior decision and initiative of God.
Chosen in Christ, and drawn by Him, the elect do come to faith. It is not that we who are called are forced to respond affirmatively.
God makes his offer so appealing that we do respond, every man in his own order. (1 Corinthians 15:23)
God's choice is based simply on His loving intention to unite all in Christ. (Ephesians 1:4,5,9,10)
ETERNAL SECURITY:
God has provided a complete salvation. Believers can know they possess this salvation, and that it is eternally secure. The will of man cannot undo the work that God has accomplished through Christ.
A believer may temporarily forget what God has done. He may become alienated, in his mind, from the life of God,(Ephesians 4:18). He is free to apostatize. Those submitting to the works of the flesh, do not inherit the kingdom of God.
However, despite this real possibility, the believer need not fear falling away. Kept by the grace of God, he will successfully endure all trials and temptations of life. The Lord is able to keep him or her from falling. Believers are able to rest in the assurance that nothing can separate them from the infinite and unfailing love of God for all mankind. There is no fear in love.
(Romans 8:29,30,39)
This universal salvation, accomplished by God, is eternally secure for everyone, through the death and resurrection of all, included in Christ, in his death, and so also, in his resurrection.
To sum up, salvation can be lost in the sense that the individual can forget what God has provided for them, and become alienated in his mind from God, once again. However, salvation can not be lost in another sense, because the will of man can not change what God has accomplished, or declared for humankind.
Hope this helps,
URfriend, Dean Johnson
My Ministry Page
http://www.angelfire.com/dc/universalism...
-- posted by URfriend
» southeastga - Re: Re: Salvation-Must it Be Renewed
In response to Re: Re: Salvation-Must it Be Renewed posted by URfriend:Greetings I would like to say that thermos100 answer was most fitting. I find that many times we complicate the bible way too much. My answer to this is the familliar passage of John 3:16 with the key word being believes. The real question then is can you unbelieve. My personal answer is no that if you truly believe you will never change your mind. An example that I give many times is this. It is the difference between hearing and believing. You tell a small child that a burner is hot. They hear it but inevidently if you leave them alone they would touch it and get burned. Grant it no one I hope would purposely do this to prove it. At that point they believe and they will never forget that it is hot. Same way with truly saved people know matter what anyone says they will never think otherwise.
-- posted by southeastga
» southeastga - Re: Re: Salvation-Must it Be Renewed
In response to Re: Re: Salvation-Must it Be Renewed posted by URfriend:Sorry about the spelling. Know in last sentence of course should have been no. Spell check was not working.
-- posted by southeastga
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