LIFE AFTER THE WHITE HOUSE, PART VI

Top 13. Nov 16, 2002 12:12 AM

» LincolnFan - Gerald Ford

John, I love the articles. (You know, of course, you have the same name as another eminent presidential historian.) I think it's very interesting about what presidents did after the White House. I am fascinated by the fact that TRUMAN --- like, only 50 years ago Truman --- was the one who petitioned Congress for their pensions! Before that, as you know, the presidents left the White House and it was "Asta la vista, baby!" (I don't know why I brought that subject up. It just occurred to me.) I agree with you that the pardon of Nixon hurt Gerald Ford most, but the Eastern Europe comment was a major major blunder. (I remember a Tony Auth cartoon that had a bunch of prisoners in leg chains, hitting rocks with sledgehammers, and one was labeled "East Germany" and the other was labeled "Poland." And one says to the other, "Pass it on. Ford says we're free.") I know appearances shouldn't matter but Ford's Eastern Europe comment added to Ford's image as a doofus. It all began when the poor guy fell down an airplane staircase and that was it. He was labeled a klutz. Chevy Chase blistered him on "Saturday Night Live." I just saw that Jimmy Carter PBS documentary and they showed Ford making that comment. The reporter who asked the question was so amazed to the point of sputtering that he asked him again and Ford REPEATED it. And they showed Carter just smiling as you knew he was going in for the kill. It was so sad because I thought Ford meant that the Russians couldnt break the satellites' spirits or something like that. And the outcome of the election was so close it must have done some damage esp since the media had a field day. But that's just my opinion. I am so glad that Ford was entered into Caroline Kennedy's book "Profiles in Courage" because the pardon truly truly was a stroke of courage that benefited the United States far more than Nixon. And to make it sweeter it was Bob Woodward who wrote the article, saying that he didnt believe in the decision then but thought it was the right thing to do.

Patrick

P.S. Keep up with the Presidents. It's great stuff!

-- posted by LincolnFan

Top 14. Nov 20, 2002 1:28 PM

» Mugwump53 - Re: Gerald Ford

In response to message posted by LincolnFan:

Hi, Patrick. Sorry it took me so long to answer your posts. I have been a little busy lately.

I agree with you that it might have been interesting if Washington had served only one term. In that case, I think the precedent would have been broken earlier in our history. You are correct that Jefferson talked him into serving a second term, but you have to remember that Hamilton joined Jefferson in that plea. It may have been the only thing the two agreed upon, and it was the fact that both men told Washington he was needed to hold things together that convinced him to accept a second term.

Actually, several men tried to break the two-term tradition. Grant tried for a third nomination in 1880, but lost it to compromise candidate Garfield. Teddy Rosevelt tried for a third term in 1912 on the Progressive or Bull Moose ticket, but also failed.

I also agree with you that the Republicans have come to regret that amendment at least twice (Ike and Reagan).

What eminent presidential historian is named John Cooper? Or should I say what other eminent presidential historian? smile

You make a good point about Gerald Ford and the Eastern Europe comment. He obviously meant western Europe, and didn't want to admit the mistake when asked again. I still think it didn't have as much effect as many claim, although taken in conjunction with the Saturday Night Live skits you mention, it may have had more effect than it would have alone.

Thanks for the words of encouragement. Let me encourage you to keep joining in and posting here. I hope to see you here often.

-- posted by Mugwump53

Top 15. Dec 19, 2002 2:39 PM

» spondulix11 - Re: Re: Gerald Ford

In response to message posted by Mugwump53:

Just currious. You mentioned Ford"s pardon of Nixon, which if I remember correctly was very early in his term as president, and you mentioned Clinton's pardoning of others just before leaving office, Why didn't you mention George Bush's pardoning of every one involved in the Iran Contra scandel?
spondulix

-- posted by spondulix11

Top 16. Dec 19, 2002 2:59 PM

» spondulix11 - Re: Reagan's idea

In response to message posted by BuckyRea:

What was Reagan's position on term limits for congress? I know that when the democrates were in control the republicans were very much in favor of term limits, I also remember that when Truman, was president he also favored term limits for congress, which was republican controled.

spondulix

-- posted by spondulix11

Top 17. Dec 19, 2002 3:12 PM

» animalspirit - Re: Re: Reagan's idea

In response to message posted by spondulix11:

I also remember that when Truman, was president he also favored term limits for congress, which was republican controled.

I didn't know that. That's interesting especially in light of his argument against term-limiting presidents - that it was more likely a president would "tear up the constitution" to use his phrase in the face of a term limit he wouldnt want to accept rather than gaining too much power through successive terms.

The Clinton impeachment is the clincher as to why the 22nd should be abolished.

A President should have had the opportunity to face the voters again after a misguided impeachment attempt.

-- posted by animalspirit

Top 18. Dec 19, 2002 3:20 PM

» animalspirit - Re: Re: Re: Gerald Ford

In response to message posted by spondulix11:

Why didn't you mention George Bush's pardoning of every one involved in the Iran Contra scandel?

As I recall there wasn't as big a stink then (compared to either the Nixon or Rich pardons). Maybe the media didn't focus as much on the fact that there was no plausible way to read the public records of Iran/Contra to derive Bush's pere's testimony denying knowledge as anything but false. Thus his pardons of North, Abrams et. al - who would be testifying in any trial of Bush - were in effect a pardon of himself.

-- posted by animalspirit

Top 19. Dec 24, 2002 5:18 PM

» Mugwump53 - Re: Re: Re: Re: Gerald Ford

In response to message posted by RussHicks:

I agree with Russ. The reason I didn't mention the Bush pardons is because they did not have any effect on the political climate at the time. Ford's pardon of Nixon is generally accepted as the reason he did not win a full term of his own. (Of course, in an election as close as the Ford-Carter race in 1976, almost any one significant factor could be claimed as the reason for the outcome.)

There have been some great discussions here recently. I am sorry I was unable to join in. I hope you all continue to participate here. thanks.

-- posted by Mugwump53

Top 20. Jan 6, 2003 8:20 AM

» spondulix - Re: Gerald Ford

In response to message posted by LincolnFan:

Unfortunatly Ford was always putting his foot in his mouth, especially on comments about geography. I read the following in one of Carter's books. "I went to Grand Rapids Michigan and found out later that I had called it Ceder Rapids. when Gerald Ford went out castigating me for it, he shouted to the T.V. cameras that apperently I didn't even know that Michigan was one of the 48 states. President Ford famous for his confusion about places, then had to spend a day or two convincing the news reporters that he really did know there were fifty states.

Jimmy Carter in Keeping Faith. p.563

Spondulix

-- posted by spondulix

Top 21. Jan 6, 2003 5:49 PM

» Mugwump53 - Re: Re: Gerald Ford

In response to message posted by spondulix:

I remember the "48 states" comment, but didn't remember that it came while he was criticizing Carter for making a geography mistake!

I remember Ford trying to convince everyone he knew better, and his comment that he voted for Alaksa and Hawaii joining the Union.

Thanks for the memories.

-- posted by Mugwump53