CLOSED!!Political Discussion - A Place to &quot;duke it out&quot; (7400+)

Top 1004. Aug 8, 2003 11:46 AM

» Fred2000 - The slate

.
Republican Peter Ueberroth, the former baseball commissioner who was named Time magazine's Man of the Year after he headed the 1984 Summer Olympics, added his name to the lengthening list of would-be candidates when he took out papers Thursday, an adviser said.

Others who have said they plan to run include independent political commentator Arianna Huffington, Democratic Insurance Commissioner John Garamendi, Republican businessman Bill Simon - and even former child actor Gary Coleman and watermelon-smashing comic Gallagher.(That's what California needs, a watermelon in the head)

"It's kind of like a freak show," said Timothy Esau, a fruit inspector (This guy knows his fruit and he's in the fruit belt) in Fresno who considers the spectacle of Schwarzenegger, Flynt and hundreds of political wannabes taking out filing papers "a bit embarrassing."

"It conveys an image that we don't give a damn about our own state," he said. Like many Democrats, Esau said he's unhappy with Davis, but "just letting him finish out his term and electing a better governor is the answer, not a recall." (That's too logical)

-- posted by Fred2000

Top 1005. Aug 8, 2003 11:49 AM

» Fred2000 - .Freak Show opens Oct 7, 2003

.
And that was before Schwarzenegger shocked even his own closest political advisers by announcing on "The Tonight Show" that he was getting in the race. (Will all 400 candidates be getting equal time?)

It's hard to look at California's election slate without giggling - or panicking. Under the recall law, drafted during a wave of populism in 1911, it takes only $3,500 and signatures from 65 voters to run.

Potential candidates so far include a lady selling thong underwear and a motorcyclist who hopes to legalize pet ferrets. And the 99 Cents Only stores in Los Angeles are running a promotion promising to pay the filing fee and gather signatures for any 99-year-old who'd "love to be gov."

-- posted by Fred2000

Top 1006. Aug 8, 2003 12:06 PM

» Fred2000 - Political tricksters play while electorate suffers...

.
There's serious anger underlying the recall's festival atmosphere. This is an electorate that in recent years has endured an energy crisis and a battering of its high-tech economy and now faces the prospect of higher taxes and fees.

"California's law has turned something important into a circus," said Brian Rosman, a tourist from Newton, Mass., visiting San Francisco on Thursday. "The problems are tax revenues, the huge corporate manipulation of the energy crisis a few years ago, the decline in the high-tech world. Those problems don't get solved by getting a new governor."

The people actually running state government have struggled, too. The state went a month without a budget as lawmakers squabbled before passing a compromise bill in July that includes billions in IOUs.

Still, it's likely one-liners will trump the bottom line, at least for now.

It was a gift to headline writers and late-night comedians around the world when the star of a movie called "Total Recall" turned into "The Running Man." And while most politicians must content themselves with Sunday morning talk shows, all Schwarzenegger had to do was go across town to chat with fellow celebrity and pal Jay Leno.

On the "Tonight Show," Schwarzenegger cast himself as a man of the people who would challenge special interests in the state Capitol. He promised to clean house in Sacramento.

"The people are working hard," he told Leno in his trademark Austrian accent. "The people are paying the taxes, the people are raising the families, but the politicians are not doing their job."

"Do your job for the people, and do it well; otherwise you are hasta la vista baby," Schwarzenegger said, in what was one of several recasts of famous lines from his movies - this one from "Terminator 2: Judgment Day."

-- posted by Fred2000

Top 1007. Aug 8, 2003 12:19 PM

» Fred2000 - Re: Bush Ratings Drop

In response to message posted by Lawhawk:

"When your 38% of your party's core constituency is saying that you're doing a good or excellent job, something is wrong. That's down significantly from 2001. Liberals are even more dissatisfied with the Democratic party."

Lawhawk... Sounds reasonable. But what are they dissatisfied about? They're dissatisfied that the candidates and the party isn't taking the conservative elements of the GOP to task for the way they are running the country. When the election heats up, and it will, they will be there throwing votes against the president. Good time for moderates ahead.

-- posted by Fred2000

Top 1008. Aug 8, 2003 12:25 PM

» Fred2000 - Quagmire commeth

.
Listening to a senior Bush administration official explain last week that America's ultimate goal in Iraq is a broad "transformation" of Middle East politics, you realize that U.S. leaders have committed the country to a battle that could, as the official admitted, last for a generation.

-- posted by Fred2000

http://www.drudgereport.com/as.htm

Top 1009. Aug 8, 2003 12:50 PM

» Fred2000 - What the........

.
Looks like Arnold will never sink.

-- posted by Fred2000

Top 1010. Aug 8, 2003 1:27 PM

» Lawhawk - Re: Quagmire commeth

In response to message posted by Fred2000:

Fred,

Just like US involvement in Europe was a quagmire that has lasted 58 years and counting? Japan for 58+ years? South Korea 53 years and counting. Are any of those areas quagmires? We still have bases in all of those areas mentioned, and significant military assets focused on their defense. We still have major strategic interests there. Why is it scary that the US will have continuing interests in Iraq?

Did you know that since the Iraq action started, less than 200 soldiers have died in combat related activities? According to Pentagon, 114 American military personnel were killed in combat from the start of the war to May 1, when President Bush declared major combat over, and 56 since. That's an amazing figure, considering that we liberated a tyrannical regime. Can more be done to reduce the number of US casualties? Sure, it's called being more aggressive in the one place that has seen continual resistance - the Sunni Triangle. Those folks haven't realized that they lost, but have a chance for redemption if they give up their arms (and Saddam for that matter). Withdrawing too soon means that those casualties are for naught.

Elsewhere, things are improving on a daily basis. You don't hear about power being restored in Basra or water flowing to the Marsh Arabs, but that's good news - it's a common thing. It's expected that the US would do those things.

The US has been involved in ME politics for more than 50 years. For much of that time it was a Cold War ethos that dominated - offset Soviet influence here with US influence there. Now, there's only Islamic fundamentalism, an intense hatred and jealousy of everything that the US and Western culture/society/economies stands for - and the US must deal with it because no one else can (or sadly, wants to).

If there is one region that needs transformation, this is it. The confluence of oil money, willingess to die killing innocent civilians using mass transportation (9/11), the free flow of weapons with that oil money, the willingness to seek out and use WMD, and a philosophy that decries everything about the West along with a reassertion of an Islamic world to dominate everything in its path, is a very dangerous one. There is no accomodation of belief here, not when it is inculcated with death to anyone who stands in their way.

Fred, we are at war with Islamic fundamentalists who have hijacked a religion and teach nothing but hatred and intolerance towards non-Muslims (consider a trip to Saudi Arabia? nope, can't do it because you're not Muslim - a true believer). A war not of our choosing was thrust upon the US way back in the 1980s and we didn't recognize it at the time. Additional battles carried into the 1990s, and still we did not fight back.

Then came 9/11, and some finally realized that we had been at war all those years. Fighting back was our only choice. Striking at the bases of those terrorists (Afghanistan) was a start. Iraq was next. Saudi Arabia - draw your own conclusions when you realize that this is the regime from which 15 of 19 hijackers came from. They were involved in funding al Qaeda, and have turned a blind eye to their terrorism as long as it didn't affect the regime. Even they can't turn that blind eye any longer because al Qaeda has come home to roost - attacking the Saudi regime directly and indirectly with terrorist attacks within the Kingdom.

Not doing anything - turning a blind eye, will not solve matters. Appeasement will only embolden terrorists everywhere. Only action can defeat those threats.

-- posted by Lawhawk

Top 1011. Aug 9, 2003 5:21 AM

» Fred2000 - Re: Quagmire commeth

In response to message posted by Lawhawk:

"Then came 9/11, and some finally realized that we had been at war all those years. Fighting back was our only choice."

Lawhawk... Where did you get the idea that I object to confronting the fundamentalist terrorists? As a matter of fact, I believe we were sidetracked from fighting the terrorists to fighting Iraq. We supposedly were in imminent danger from WMD but that proved to be false.

The War Lords and Taliban in Afghanistan are resurging because we dropped the ball there. We lost interest in Osama, the head terrorist.

We've taken steps to make commercial air trafic safer but did hardly anything to secure shipping or air cargo traffic. Meanwhile the president is all politics with his landing on the Lincoln wrongly announcing the end of hostilities. A large number of his cabinet and appointees are fleeing his administration, the latest being Powel who is too much of a gentleman to just up and leave.

The president has surrounded himself with hawks who only see war as the answer. Going into Iraq was no war but simply an attack upon a weakling nation with an inferior army by a superpower with high tech weaponry. The president stood on the Lincoln boldly claiming victory like a bully in the schoolyard who picks on the little kids.

-- posted by Fred2000

Top 1012. Aug 9, 2003 7:34 AM

» javelin - Re: Re: Quagmire commeth

In response to message posted by Fred2000:

The War Lords and Taliban in Afghanistan are resurging because we dropped the ball there. We lost interest in Osama, the head terrorist.

In the battle of Afghanistan, we destroyed the Taliban

Bush, USS Lincoln

Taliban Attack Kills Six Afghan Soldiers
Thu Aug 7, 9:10 AM ET

By NOOR KHAN, Associated Press Writer

KANDAHAR, Afghanistan - Dozens of suspected Taliban fighters attacked a government office in southern Afghanistan (news - web sites) early Thursday, killing six Afghan soldiers and an Afghan driver for an American aid organization, a provincial intelligence chief said.

The attack — one of the most brazen and well-organized recent assaults in the region — was possibly part of a trend involving militants targeting Afghans working for foreign agencies.

The violence occurred about 4 a.m. in Deshu district, about 110 miles south of Lashkargah, the capital of Helmand province.

At least six Afghans working for the American aid organization Mercy Corps were conducting an agricultural survey in the region and were staying in the building at the time, said the intelligence chief, Dad Mohammed Khan.

Khan said about 40 suspected Taliban fighters drove up in four vehicles, entered the government offices and opened fire. The use of the vehicles was unusual and bold. The militants usually travel on foot, making them less conspicuous.

The driver had been sleeping in the same room with the soldiers. None of the other Afghan Mercy Corps employees were injured, Khan said. He gave no other details, but said his men were pursuing the attackers.

Abdullah, a Mercy Corps communications officer reached by satellite phone in the southern city of Kandahar, said only three of the agency's Afghan employees were staying in the compound at the time. Abdullah, like many Afghans, uses only one name.

He said the aid workers spent the night in Deshu because it was too late to return to Kandahar. Most aid workers do not travel on Afghan roads after dark — particularly in the country's volatile south.

Lashkargah is about 90 miles northwest of Kandahar, the stronghold of Afghanistan's former Taliban ruler, Mullah Mohammed Omar.

The Taliban, who were ousted in a U.S.-led war on terror in late 2001, have been waging a hit-and-run guerrilla war in the south and east of the country for over a year. In the last few months, they've stepped up attacks on foreign troops, government forces and aid workers.

-- posted by javelin