Affair at Camp Jackson: Nathaniel Lyon, Part VII
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- Wrap10
- Wrap10
- georule
- Wrap10
- phillicr
- Wrap10
- georule
- georule
- spondulix
- Wrap10
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» Wrap10 - Re: Dead at Camp Jackson
In response to message posted by georule:Thanks George. I'll have to double-check the sources I was using, as I thought they all mentioned the 28 figure as the civilian casualties alone. Could be I just didn't read close enough.
I wouldn't want to suggest that the exact number isn't important - goodness knows it was to the folks involved - but I do think the exchange of gunfire itself was the larger story, at least where the big picture was concerned. I think the impact may have been the same, or at least close to the same, even if only one person had been killed. The pro-southern faction in St. Louis certainly worked to exploit the 'massacre,' and I can't really blame them. In their place I would have done the same thing.
-- posted by Wrap10
» Wrap10 - Re: Dead at Camp Jackson
Something else I might mention here, just as a general note. Even though this series on Lyon is running longer than I originally expected, there is still quite a bit about the whole situation in Missouri that isn't being included due to space limitations.Just as an example, before he marched on Camp Jackson, Lyon worked very hard to convince the members of the pro-Union Committee of Safety that his actions against the camp were necessary. They all eventually came around, but it had been a hard sell for a few of them.
I'll be listing some sources at the end of the series that hopefully will help point anyone interested into taking a closer look at the whole story. The events in 1861 Missouri are fairly complex and truly fascinating, and I'm afraid I don't really do it justice. It isn't nearly as well known as some of the events back east, but it's every bit as interesting once you begin looking into it.
-- posted by Wrap10
» georule - Re: Re: Dead at Camp Jackson
In response to message posted by Wrap10:Perry--
No, the exact number isn't all that important in the larger picture. I don't want to sound nitpicky either, as I think you're doing a fine job at this length.
Of course you don't have to sell *me* on how fascinating all this is. Neither my wife (my co-webmaster) nor myself have familial ties to the war in Missouri. We just fell in love with the story, almost by accident, and expect to spend quite a few more years on it.
Best. Geo
-- posted by georule
» Wrap10 - Re: Re: Re: Dead at Camp Jackson
In response to message posted by georule:George,
No, you're not nitpicking. If you or anyone else finds something to take issue with in one of the articles, large or small, feel free to bring it up. If I don't like it I'll just ban you from the board. (Just kidding.)
I can see why you and your wife would be taken with the story. It can really draw a person in. A lot of it sounds like it should come straight out of a novel or a movie script or something. And some of the personalities involved are about as colorful as any around.
I think that's part of the reason the story about Lyon in drag makes me wonder. It fits so well with the image of him and what was going on at that time, it's almost too perfect. Sort of like, "and on top of everything else, Lyon ran around dressed as a pistol-packing bearded woman."
I don't know, maybe it's one of those things that's so far-fetched, it has to be true. No fiction writer would dare make it up.
-- posted by Wrap10
» phillicr - Lyon in Drag
Hi - I found the confirmation of the story in a memorandum by Franklin A. Dick, later PMG of St. Louis, who was a Lyon cohort and Blair brother-in-law, located at the Library of Congress. He wrote how the entire ruse came off, though to what purpose I don't know. Anyway, I was skeptical as well, but when presented with such evidence, as well as the more colloquial evidence that has surfaced over the years indicating the same story, I had to relent. How he managed to cover the beard is indeed a mystery; perhaps he shaved it. If so, no one has said. Oh, I should have mentioned in the previous post that Mira Alexander, the widow whose costume Lyon appears to have donned, was Franklin A. Dick's mother-in-law (his wife's mother). Or so I recall. Glad you all are enjoying the book.Chris Phillips
-- posted by phillicr
» Wrap10 - Re: Lyon in Drag
In response to message posted by phillicr:Hi Chris, and welcome to the board. Nice to have you stop by.
Thanks for the extra information about the infamous Lyon-in-drag question. From the sound of all that, I guess maybe it really is true. Interesting thought about him possibly shaving his beard. That would make the story sound a little more plausible if he did.
Yes, great job on the book. I enjoyed it. It reads well, and has the feel of thorough research about it. (Consider that an unpaid endorsement, although you can pay me if you wish. 
Was there anything you learned about Lyon during your research that surprised you?
-- posted by Wrap10
» georule - Re: Lyon in Drag
In response to message posted by phillicr:Somehow I can't let the mention of Dick as PMG go without mentioning my single favorite John N. Edwards' line: "Hither came the trusty agents of Missouri's cruel hyena, F. A. Dick, Provost Marshal of St. Louis..." from Shelby and his Men by John N. Edwards, 1867
Yes, Edwards is a guilty pleasure. Al Castel encouraged me to commit full-scale biography on him someday; perhaps I shall.
Best. Geo
-- posted by georule
» spondulix - Re: Re: Lyon in Drag
In response to message posted by georule:
wrap
For me at least the furture of Civil War study is from the perspective of the Tran's Mississippi area and the west. One can only do so much with the retelling of Gettysburg. The more we can read about the area west of the Mississippi the better.
After all the war actually started in that area didn't it?
Good article Perry.
It's looks like I shouldn't have been so harsh on them poor Sooners, crushed! and with it the hole southern conference crushed and humiliated and by Kansas Red legs.
curtis
-- posted by spondulix
» Wrap10 - Re: Re: Re: Lyon in Drag
In response to message posted by spondulix:Thanks Curtis. Yes, good point about the Trans-Mississippi. As for Oklahoma, what can you say. After twelve games of arduous service marked by valiant domination of every opponent, the mighty Big Red was compelled to yield to an overwhelming fanny whipping. It happens I guess.
-- posted by Wrap10
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